No install

It really depends.

PROS:
reqires less pys. memory
could add better copy protection methods
kid friendly - extreem beginner

CONS:
slow loading times
realtime loading causes extreem speed lag
ups computer requirements
makes updating game extreemly difficult
makes extensions extreemly difficult

Im sure there are many more

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EDIT:

It would probably be a good method for light-weight games, such as games in the puzzle genre that makes use of few resources. On the other hand, Putting larger projects on a CD (ones that use many resources) is impractical.

DVD format runs a little bit faster, and resources would load a bit faster. So if you are running off a DVD it may be practical for more uses. It is still slower then direct PC loading, and makes it diffictult to patch

[edited by - paulcesar on November 22, 2003 12:53:34 PM]

[edited by - paulcesar on November 22, 2003 12:58:44 PM]

At many places you either can''t install (school,library) or don''t want to install ( work). But if you could play directly off the cd and then save your game to a 3.5" floppy( instead of hard drive) then you will leave no evidence that you ever played there.

you forgot the largest con: you NEED the CD to play. how annoying.

quote:

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Original post by GiantPaul
Is it a good idea to make a game where you don''t need to install, setup, or copy anything from the cd. You just pop the cd inside and play from it. Only when you save your game then it saves the file to your computer.

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IMO, yes it is a good idea. Its the way things once were on home computers, and the way things still are on games consoles. Much more user friendly.

It''s also entirely feasible - however you need to pay much closer attention to the file handling in your game than you would in a usual HDD installed PC game. Consoles have slower CD/DVD drives than the average PC has, less physical memory and [usually] no virtual memory so significant planning goes into file handling in console games.

Some general points and things to think about to make a game work well straight off CD:

- Seeks (movement of the read head) on CD media are painfully slow - avoid them at all costs. Practically this means ensuring the physical location of the data on the CD is ordered sequentially in the order the game will load it. Anywhere the read head/laser needs to "skip" forward or back is a seek - and is redundant time that you could have read a few megabytes of data in.

- Most modern CD/DVD drives are CAV (Constant Angular Velocity). With CAV, the maximum data rate you can read at changes depending on the location of the read laser! With those, you get a higher rate near the outside of the disc (past the part susceptible to "wobble error") than you do on the inside of the disc. Early CD drives were CLV though (Constant Linear Velocity) which vary the spin speed to keep the data rate constant.

- Using asyncronous loading is a must - ideally you should be able to predict which data will be required "soon" and start loading it as the game is being played.

- Large archive files sorted into access order are a nice way to ensure the data is layed out in the way you''d want.

- Remember to get your CD check right (I''ve posted a method that works in the past few months here) - if you don''t, your game will annoy the hell out of people with multiple CD drives and even multichangers.

- You might want to consider pre-caching data read off the CD as part of your prediction mechanism.


If you make a game that''s playable straight from CD you also make the experience much nicer for users who have chosen the "minimum install" option in your installer.

quote:

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Original post by krez
you forgot the largest con: you NEED the CD to play. how annoying.

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The millions of console owners in the world don''t seem to mind.

The same as the millions of car drivers in the world don''t seem to mind needing keys to start their cars

The people who watch films on video and DVD don''t seem to mind either


Games come in big, colourful, easy to locate boxes that are usually sat on a shelf near the games playing device. IMO it''s only a problem if you have 100s of games on loose CDs with handwritten labels...


Having said that, I do believe there should still be an option to install to HDD - user''s choice.

quote:

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Original post by S1CA
The millions of console owners in the world don''t seem to mind.

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because they bought the console without having a choice, and knowing it ahead of time.

why do you think many x-box owners get a mod chip and start copying their games onto the hard drive?

why do you think so many PC games that require a CD check have cracks to play without the CD?

i don''t mean the warez d00ds either; many legitimate users download a crack just to avoid having to keep the CD around.

quote:

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Having said that, I do believe there should still be an option to install to HDD - user''s choice.

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that is a good option indeed

Im not sure how many people do it for the piracy issue, but im sure it is more then the bennificial amount. (any yes, letting a friend borrow the CD to install, while you retain a copy is piracy). Keep your cd''s by the computer, there is no problem.

I dont agree with the slow CD on the consoles though. Im not sure about the rest of them, but PS2 runs normal PSX cd''s at a faster then the best (PC-CDROM) read speeds. It can do this, because the CD''s are built to harness the speeds, percision, and such, and CD''s are built to a much tighter specification then PC-CD-ROMS (lower error rate).

quote:

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Original post by Anonymous Poster
umm...i think everyone knows consoles need their media to be inserted each time, we''ve been doing it since the dawn of games...

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exactly. it is a given, and we have no choice in the matter.

quote:

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as for xbox, most people who put games on the harddisk are doing it for piracy, there might be one or two out there, but i can gaurentee its usually for emulators,divs,piracy...

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if you say so. i personally know a few people who do it for sheer convenience (as well as the "i modded my xbox" thrill)... i would as well, but i am unlucky and know it will burst into flames the moment i void my warranty.

quote:

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Original post by PaulCesar
Keep your cd''s by the computer, there is no problem.

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in a perfect world, yes. but, i have a family (including a 3 year old) and things do not remain where they are placed.

all i am saying is there is no reason to force someone to insert their CD every time they want to play; the "no-CD" crack will be on the internet within hours of release, so it will only annoy legitimate users.

Thé solution for this is DVD-RAM, the only problem is that almost nobody has a drive for that...

A DVD-RAM has one fixed written side (eg. with the game itself on it) and another rewritable side, to save updates, configuration, saved games, etc.

But as I said: there aren''t many people who have such a drive.

"My basic needs in life are food, love and a C++ compiler"
[Project AlterNova] [Novanet]

I''ve thought about offering this option. It would be handy for folks who can''t, or don''t want to commit a large amount of hard drive space for a game they play infrequently.

It''s also a good excuse to get very good at streaming content from the CD on the fly.

"Without deviation, progress itself is impossible." -- Frank Zappa