My objection to the whole reseller mentality starts with the concept of player ownership.

Do you own anything when you play an MMO? Maybe because I look at it more as a designer than a gamer, but when I play an MMO I feel I'm leasing/renting usage. Yes I pay a box fee as a one-time "door charge", but my monthly fee is leasing the use of my characters and their items. What do I really "own"?

So yes, as a developer I do argue against players reseller items and characters - although I am in favor of a developer putting mechanisms in place to control sales of these things through the game itself.

Speaking from a legal standpoint: the developer and the player have entered into a lease agreement. The player pays X amount of money to "rent" a character and space in the game environment.

If the player then sells their account, I - as the developer - am under no obligation to honor that agreement anymore. Our agreement didn't include an option for you to sublet, or transfer the obligations of the agreement to another person. I entered into a contract with you - not with the other person.

I think if, as a developer, you don't want people reselling characters or goods you have an obligation to very clearly indicate to the player base that they do not own anything in your game, except the "key" (box software) to enter the game server. Everything else is leased, not owned.

Otherwise don't complain when you see items in your game being auctioned on eBay :shrug:

I'm not sure how many of you here have played/play an MMO before, but coming from FFXI, this shit just destroys the game's economy. Inflation is completely out of control in this game because of gil-sellers (people who play just to get in-game money and sell to companies like ige). I have actually just quit the game because the economy was so bad, there was no way for me to make enough money in a decent amount of time.

Blizzard has been watching other MMOs for a long time, noting the successes and problems of others, learning how to make the best MMO around. Frankly, I think they've succeeded, but it will take a very active stance on Blizz's part to keep the economy stable even though many measures have been implemented to prevent such ebaying and money-selling.

I, for one, greatly applaud Blizzard for this post. They know what's going on and how to stop it.

If you tell the users that they don't own their items, but they just lease them from you, expect them to hate you and not play your game (unless it's the best game there). I know, many MMORPGs do have that clause in their license, but if the developers would actually enforce it, everyone would leave.
A lot of players are power players, and they are very possesive about their items and skills.
And there is nothing wrong with selling your items for RL money. You work for them, so what's wrong with selling them? If that ruins the economy, well, though luck, that's why the big MMORPGs get so much money, so they can hire smart people and design an economy/gameplay that doesn't suffer from this problem.

FWIW: GameDev.net is not a licenced practitioner of law. It cannot give legal advice, and neither can its members. Thus, asking about the legality or not of a specific situation shouldn't really be done here -- if you really need to know, talk to a lawyer licensed in your state and skilled in the particular area of law you're interested in.

SOME companies actually embrace exchange between real money and virtual money. Project Entropia, There, and Second Life come to mind.

It is certainly legal to allow the selling of virtual items. The only issue is how wise is it for a developer/publisher to give the practice legal status within their game.

As has been pointed out, if the game allows it then that grants certain property rights to the players and as a result they can sue the publisher/developer for loss of that property. However, if the developer/publisher refuses then players may be annoyed and not play the game. Certainly the most sensible route would be to ban the practice (so that you are not liable) but not actually take drastic action to enforce it - so the practice can go on outside of the game BUT only if you actually want such players in your game.

This of course ignores the other problem - that of playability. The practice damages the economy of the game and makes it unplayable for many. The developer/publisher must balance the needs of those who want to play the game as it was designed against those who want to profit from the game. Frankly I would choose the former every time and do everything I could to prevent the practice. MMOG are games, they aren't a source of income for players and developers should not be expected to allow them to be treated as such.

Quote: Original post by hplus0603
FWIW: GameDev.net is not a licenced practitioner of law. It cannot give legal advice, and neither can its members. Thus, asking about the legality or not of a specific situation shouldn't really be done here -- if you really need to know, talk to a lawyer licensed in your state and skilled in the particular area of law you're interested in.

SOME companies actually embrace exchange between real money and virtual money. Project Entropia, There, and Second Life come to mind.

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear about the topic name. I'm not looking for legal advise [grin], I'm just looking for opinions about the subject and what people think about selling these kinds of items.

The fact is they have no legal right to these "items" as the "property" in question doesn't exist in the first place.

Quote: Original post by Anonymous Poster
The fact is they have no legal right to these "items" as the "property" in question doesn't exist in the first place.

Are you saying I don't own my Windows XP or any of my Word documents I make and they are not my "property"?

Maybe the problem isn't the players with more loot than they can reasonably use. Maybe it's the idiots-convinced-they're-geniuses game designers who created a system that rapidly spirals into item inflation, creating a surplus of overpowered items that create a market of veteran players selling to new players.

Said idiots then balk at the system they've put in place and instead of fixing the root source of the problem, fall back on tried-and-failed-repeatedly-in-history dictatorial methods and attempt to block a free market system by fiat. Once again proving that they are a) idiots, and b) probably should have stayed out of the MMORPG arena in the first place.

-David

Account selling is hard to really stop, so I won't address it.

As for MMORPG item selling, it can be limited quite a bit if they had actually put in some thought.

Early online RPGs I've played (such as Legends of Kesmai and Kingdom of Drakkar) had a good system for keeping people from selling items: Item tying/attunement. Simply, items not store bought tied to the character (or in the case of KOD, the account) upon either pick up or death of the monster holding the item at the hands of the player. Modern RPGs don't have this for some reason I can't fathom. Now, it's not foolproof, but it's very much less likely to produce baby characters with advanced armor/weapons.

Blizzard should have implemented this. It would have saved them multitude of problems.