Game programming trouble

Quote:

Original post by programering It's gone a couple of years and I still haven't got any game results. When I don't like my code I've written.

Why don't you like it?

Quote:

Original post by programering When it doesn't feel good the way i'm doing things, I get stuck

Everyone gets stuck, and there's usually a reason for it.

Quote:

Original post by programering then I don't feel for coding anymore. I give upp,

Do something else, like sound effects, music, or art. Possibly marketing

Quote:

Original post by programering I don't get anything or very little done. Then it's never going to finished.

Do you set goals for yourself, then have steps to achieve your goals then reward yourself when you achieve these steps?

Quote:

Original post by programering I wonder how Carmack can work so well. That he never gets stuck. I wish I was as productive as he is.

It's not that he doesn't get stuck, he works really hard.

Quote:

Original post by eedok Why don't you like it?

Maybe I am overreacting.
Then I got to think how I can do it another way.

Quote:

Original post by eedok Everyone gets stuck, and there's usually a reason for it.

Do you get stuck?

Quote:

Original post by eedok Do something else, like sound effects, music, or art. Possibly marketing

Quote:

Original post by eedok Do you set goals for yourself, then have steps to achieve your goals then reward yourself when you achieve these steps?

Quote:

Original post by eedok It's not that he doesn't get stuck, he works really hard.

But he is very passioneted about it, He's got the energy.
He loves his work, he's so productive.

Quote:

Original post by programering Quote: Original post by eedok Everyone gets stuck, and there's usually a reason for it. Do you get stuck?

Yes, every once in a while.

Quote:

Original post by programering But he is very passioneted about it, He's got the energy. He loves his work, he's so productive.

Does this sound like a cause or effect to you?(or to put it in other ways does it sound like he likes his job because he's productive, or is he productive because he likes his job?)

and one question you left unanswered:

Quote:

Original post by eedok Do you set goals for yourself, then have steps to achieve your goals then reward yourself when you achieve these steps?

Quote:

Original post by programering When I don't like my code I've written.

Something I've been trying lately is lots of various designs for small subsets of a game. See, the last thing I've done with game programming was Radical Racers, and the code is absolute crap and it took me 3 years to finish...so yeah, I get stuck too.

So what I'm doing now in my spare time is writing little engines, like an OpenGL wrapper right now, through many iterations. Each one trying a new type of design, if I don't like where it's going I start a whole new project and try again. The idea is I stay interested in what I'm doing, and hopefully when I'm done I'll have a nice little engine I can reuse to make little games or something, also probably through lots of try-n-toss iterations.

See, my problem was I get overwhelmed and discrouaged when I'm working on something too big. Now I'm writing things as small and simple as I can, and hopefully eventually I can build on that and stay motivated to make bigger and better things out of the little modules I've made, sorta like legos.

Basically my advice is to make programs like you don't care if you ever see them again, but write code like you're going to be reading it again (ie. still try to write good code, not sloppy).


Or maybe this is terrible advice, any thoughts?

I'm programming right now, I have to,
cause I can't let myself do to nothing about it.

There is nothing that says you absolutely must do a lot of game programming. If you never become a successful game programmer you aren't going to hell, and you aren't any worse of a person. You'd prefer to be productive and get things done, and it can be healthy to appreciate somebody like Carmack, but comparing yourself to an impossibly high set of standards that may or may not be reality (you don't know carmack in person I'm guessing) is irrational.

I think people like Carmack and various people on these boards are successful because they can just kind of detach themselves enough to open their IDE and just start coding, and then coupled with whatever natural talents they have they get stuff done. You only have control over one of these two factors though.

I think you need to go easier on yourself, there's no magic trick for doing something hard like game programming, and there is no easy or clear answer all of the time.

I do believe that 'programming because you have to' is just going to torture you to the point that programming won't be worth it.

I have pretty much the exact same problem. I haven't really done any game programming in like 3 years. If you find that you are continuing to have these problems, you are probably focusing on the wrong things. Try and make something that is more easily attainable and will help you grow in knowledge and experience. Try and come up with an idea that is interesting to you, and seems like it would be easily doable. Coding for the sake of coding is usually pretty impossible. I understand that you want to just program, but without something worthwile to work on, you aren't going to be able to do anything at all. Also, don't spend to much time trying to do "planning" or "design". Don't completely skip those either. Make sure to decide on just enough details and "design stuff" to get you started and ensure you won't be screwed later, and then START CODING!

I speak from experience, I have all the same problems, and they're probably 10x worse for me. I haven't completely overcome all of them, but I've made tiny amounts of progress over the years. Lately, lack of time has been my biggest hindrance. Actually, its time management. You really need to have a certain time (maybe a day in the week where you always have free time, or a certain time of day) that you can dedicate to programming games, and you need to be in the habit of doing that, otherwise you will NEVER do it and you won't get much done. I don't have that. Thus, I never do any coding when at home. Don't be like me. Overcome these problems as soon as you can. Hope this helped you a bit, now go and do some coding!

Quote:

Original post by programering It's gone a couple of years and I still haven't got any game results. When I don't like my code I've written. When it doesn't feel good the way i'm doing things, I get stuck then I don't feel for coding anymore. I give upp, I don't get anything or very little done. Then it's never going to finished. I wonder how Carmack can work so well. That he never gets stuck. I wish I was as productive as he is. Anyone with the same problem?

I've found that it helps if I determine which of the following I'm trying to do before beginning a project:
A) This is experiment. I will try anything that sounds new and exciting. I will also try to improve my engine. Set your goals high

B) This is an actual game. I will be realistic about what I am capable of. Some engine improvements and experimenting may be necessary, but I will keep these to a minimum so that the project can actually reach completion. Set your goals low. You can always make improvements AFTER you have a completed product.

I always had trouble going in circles trying to make everything perfect and never going anywhere, too. Now I'm in a class (just for fun) called 'Physics for Game Development'. It's pretty basic stuff; we're using VPython with simple graphics and simple physics. It means we actually have to get stuff done, though. We have to just sit down and get our project working, and who cares about how good the code looks. Afterwords, if we have time (which we never do), we can improve it.

Don't sit around trying to make everything perfect. Get something that works.

Refactor. Inject additional quality into your existing code. You'll like it more when it's done, plus you usually refactor while you're still highly familiar with your original, hackish efforts.

Most of us aren't very productive in a macro sense because we haven't learned to refactor. Instead, we choose to rewrite, which throws away all the bugfixes and wisdom accumulated in the existing code.

Refactor.

Everyone gets stuck/unmotivated/bored. I been programming for many years now as a hobbyist, and I have yet to actually churn out something productive. Granted theres always something else to do, like work, sleep, wife, life. You just have to find what motivates you, if you lose interest in something usually its because its not really what you wanted to do. This is my theory behind why all those zelda/FF/dragon warrior clones never get finished, because if its really what you wanted to do, you would do it.

it is suposed to be hard

flipping burgers that is easy

Flipping burgers easy? Since when? I'll stick to programming - when I am stuck it provides me with the motivation to carry on and work harder.

i mean flipping burgers as an example of repeated task work, the kind where people watch a 1 hour training video with silly songs in their first day in job that prepares them for their intire career

the oposite of a career that anyone would want unless they are in necessity of the money

Almost everyone gets stuck at some point. You have to keep working to overcome the problem instead of giving up when this happens. Sometimes you just need a break, and that's fine, but you won't get anywhere if you don't go back to it and stick with it after whatever break you take.

Quote:

Original post by programering When I don't like my code I've written.

So improve it so that you do like it. As Oluseyi said, learn to refactor your code, and see if you can produce something of higher quality that you'll likely be happier with. At the same time, also be sure you're actually completing something sometimes so that you can be happy with the resultant product of your code. Set goals, and go about meeting them.

Quote:

When it doesn't feel good the way i'm doing things, I get stuck

I think we've established by now that everyone get's stuck at times. You need to find solutions. Take a break if neccesary, but make sure you set a time to come back to it, and then make sure you actually do so. Try a different approach, ask for help, or look for resources on the topic. Sometimes you can work on something else for a while (which is sort of like a break), but again make sure you come back to it.

Quote:

then I don't feel for coding anymore. I give upp,

Don't give up. As I've said several times already, take a break if neccesary, or work on something else for a while, but always make sure you come back to it. Ultimately you have to persist if you want to get anything done.


Once again, this looks like an excellent place for me to recommend these excellent articles, by Steve Pavlina of Dexterity Software. You can find some additional personal development articles here on his own site.

Of particular interest to you at the moment might be Overcoming Procrastination, From Slump To Supercharged, and Cultivating Burning Desire. Check them out, they're an excellent read. In the end though, it comes down to you putting in the effort and sticking with it.

My approach (I had the same problems you did)--

Make a list of milestone goals, example:
1) Make sprite class that can XX and YY
2) Design a map structure and make a blank test map
3) Make a sound factory class
.....

Do that ahead of time and plan out the "general" logical setup of the application, nailing it out one step at a time.

Now here's how I make it work: The moment I finish a step, I STOP programming (even if I'm in the groove or what not). Ending a small run of programming on a "high note" instead of burnout leaves a much better overall feeling about coding.

The longer I did this, the more I felt myself looking forward to coding next time. Also by doing this, the code is segmented and feels more like I'm 'completely finishing' each little module instead of the 'bearly changing the mammoth code' dilima.

Very less overwhelming way to approach it. Just make sure (if you try it) that the milestone goals are small enough to be done in 2-6 hours of time, or roughly however much time you have to program minus 20%. That way you can actually finish it in your timeframe, even with bugs/mistakes.

Well, thanks for your advice then guys.

Currently I'm studying at this school Sundsgården at Helsingborg
I'm living here on this school now, but I go home everyother weekend.
My new computer is left at home, on where I have the dev-tools,
the MSVC++ IDE, compilator.
But I have laid over all my projects to my MP3 player, a USB memory device
(1GB storage capacity, but actuelly it's capacity is only 994MB),
so I can work here at school on it.
I went home this weekend and I've got worked
on it a little before I went back again.

Is that I've got the creative desire to create to gain satisfaction.
When I don't feel for coding and when I don't even feel for playing games
I'm really bored, and nothing sucks more than that.

And nothing feel so good when you are productive, when things goes on rails,
gets results, see them and accomplish the game.

I've would love to show you my game when it's ready.

What's your current projects you are working on?
-Mine is Tile Quest Engine, and another 2D above view game playing humans.

Have you ever accomplished any of your games?
-Me, nothing yet.

But I think it maybe goes a little up and down for the moment about feeling for it.
I think I feel a bit for programming after this day of school is over.

I'm just curious. What have you guys accomplished?
What's your current projects right now?