i

Here we go... I''m sure you could find something like this if you search the forums

I can see this is going to be a very interesting thread.
Major wars can happen here. In this case, that''s a good thing.

I have not programmed anything but Visual C++, and hence
I can not give a objective opinion. I could give you a
one sided subjective one based on what I''ve heard, but I
won''t do that. I''ll just sit back and watch this thread with
interest.

Your best opinions I believe will come from those who have
done extensive programming in both, and have chosen one over
the other.

Damn, it''s hard for me not to voice my opinion.

quote:

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Original post by aeleneski
What do you think is better visual basic or c++? Give me your feedback and why you think this.

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The question is totally unanswerable in it''s current form. Better for what? They both have their strengths and weaknesses. What do you want to do with them?

if you want to throw together a front end or a prototype for something quickly and easily, VB is the language for you. If you want a faster, more stable and more powerful program, and have the time for a slightly longer development process, C++ is the better language.


Edited by - Sandman on December 3, 2001 7:10:31 PM

You''ve got to be kidding me!

The linux geek has used VB more than the Windows users?

VB
pros:

• Good for window layout under MS Windows. (A "Hello World." program amounts to drawing. As mentioned previously, the C/MFC way to do it requires 271 lines of code. There are of course better ways to do it than MFC, but visual layout is generally going to be easier).
  
• An idiot can use it. (Where I work now, some of the managers know enough to be able to do mock-up window layouts for what they want, makes the design process go a bit smoother)
  

cons:

• The big one: It''s MS Windows only. Forget about porting to Macintosh, Linux, Be, Playstation 2, Gamecube, and probably even palm top and XBox.
  
• The petty one: I personally find the syntax to be a little ugly.
  
• The really petty one: The text editor in the IDE drives me up the wall.
  
• The really really petty one: nes8bit uses it :p
  

C/C++
pros:

• It''s everywhere. Yep. With a careful choice in libraries, porting to new platforms can be relatively painless. And there are plenty of other C coders out there and plenty of example code.
  
• It''ll generally run a bit faster.
  
• I''d rather tell a stranger that I am a C coder, than to tell them I''m a VB coder.
  
• An idiot can''t use it. Well, maybe they can...
  

cons:

• Window layout can be a chore.
  
• braces.
  
• It''s fairly easy to write unreadable code.
  

The verdict
Use Python instead.

Seriously, it doesn''t hurt to know both, even if you''re not a Windows coder. C is pretty much the standard, while VB can make a passable design tool for non-programmers who don''t mind getting their hands a little bit dirty. If you want to go into the game industry though, C (or C++) is the language to focus on.

*bends over and rips apart ass*

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quote:

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Original post by nes8bit
*bends over and rips apart ass*

---

That was unexpected.

[Resist Windows XP''s Invasive Production Activation Technology!]

OMG TI WUS NES8BIT ALL TEH TIEM!!!!!!"!"!!%&§§@@

back to topic:

I havent tried vb, allthough I dont understand why braces are bad ? Ive seen samples of code without braces and it seemed a lot less readable than code with braces, but that might offcourse be because I havent ever been coding without using braces and.. umm.. ok I''ll stop now.

"A "Hello World." program amounts to drawing. As mentioned previously, the C/MFC way to do it requires 271 lines of code. There are of course better ways to do it than MFC, but visual layout is generally going to be easier"

Actually, in a previous thread it was shown that a C "Hello World" program could be written with only 1 unreadable line. It was also mentioned that MFC was not designed for simple "Hello World" programs.

Invader X
Invader''s Realm

quote:

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Original post by Invader X
Actually, in a previous thread it was shown that a C "Hello World" program could be written with only 1 unreadable line. It was also mentioned that MFC was not designed for simple "Hello World" programs.

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I agree. MFC wasn''t designed for any sort of programs If it takes 271 lines to do basically nothing, then I shudder when I think of how much code would be required to actually do something. I guess one unreadable line is better than 271 unreadable lines.

But yes, there are much better ways to do GUI coding in C. I wouldn''t expect my boss to be able to handle any of them, though.

Jesper T:
Couldn''t let VB have too many more cons than C. Python is a very readable language, and doesn''t use braces for grouping code.

nessy:
Please don''t turn this into another fluffy bunny thread.

quote:

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Original post by Jesper T
OMG TI WUS NES8BIT ALL TEH TIEM!!!!!!"!"!!%&§§@@

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Sorry. This topic in particular needed my intellectual, and unbiassed comments to help better the conversation.

---------------------------------------------

I want to be the first person to actually answer the question... but... I can''t bring myself to do it.

I think the best answer to this is what has already been said: search the site and you''ll find your answer.

quote:

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Original post by nes8bit
Sorry. This topic in particular needed my intellectual, and unbiassed comments to help better the conversation.

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*cough*

Here I''ve summarised what I consider to be the major differences between VB and C++. No opinion as to the relative merits of the differences is implied. However, if you want to do stuff that involves using features not available in VB, use C++; if you need to use features not available in C++, use VB; If you need to use features not available in either language, tough.

Visual Basic Got It, C++ Ain''t

• Properties.
  
• Easy to create GUIs.
  
• In-language COM support.
  
• Strings are first-order types.
  
• Automatic memory management.
  
• Event-based paradigm.
  

C++ Got It, Visual Basic Ain''t

• Inheritance.
  
• Operator overloading.
  
• Pointers.
  
• First-order arrays and functions.
  
• Easy to create new controls at run-time.
  
• MFC.
  
• Speed.
  
• Portable.
  
• Preprocessor.
  

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Just Plain Wrong

In addition to the things already mentioned...

C++ also has inline assembly support on most compliers.
C++ has compliers available for it that don''t CRASH ALL THE &@!$ING TIME.

Visual Basic is great for, say... uh... I... you could... the buttons are very pretty, and it makes it really easy to create an INTERACTIVE* COMIC BOOK.

C++ has more of a learning curve, but it''s sort of like... It''s easier to learn how to throw a rock than how to shoot a sniper rifle, but when you just cant take it anymore and it''s time to run up to that bell tower with your tin foil hat and rubber pants, which would you rather use? Can''t fight off Emperor Zargoth''s mind-controlled alien protoplasms with a ROCK, now can you?

* Interactive comic book contains no actual interaction.

quote:

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Original post by Carnivorous_Duck
C++ has compliers available for it that don''t CRASH ALL THE &@!$ING TIME.

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Not VC++, then.

quote:

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It''s easier to learn how to throw a rock than how to shoot a sniper rifle, ... Can''t fight off Emperor Zargoth''s mind-controlled alien protoplasms with a ROCK, now can you?

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That depends on the size of the rock relative to the protoplasms.

It is also worth noting that a sniper rifle is unlikely to be particularly effective on a protoplasmic lifeform: you''d want something like a flamethrower.

Or, better yet, you could appeal to the protoplasms'' better nature, and inspire them to fight against Zargoth''s mind control: finally sacrificing themselves in order to secure the absolute destruction of that evil tyrant.

Besides, what you are going to do about Destructron, Emperor Zargoth''s invincible Robot Of Death?

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Just Plain Wrong

quote:

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Or, better yet, you could appeal to the protoplasms' better nature, and inspire them to fight against Zargoth's mind control: finally sacrificing themselves in order to secure the absolute destruction of that evil tyrant.

Besides, what you are going to do about Destructron, Emperor Zargoth's invincible Robot Of Death?

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I think something like Destructron would require some seriously heavy artillery. Maybe the Multiphase Plasma Disassociator Cannon would suffice, but you would need the Robot Exoskeleton from level 4 to carry it and enough Plasma Cells to charge it up to full power. Of course, even that wouldnt kill him, because he is invincible, but it might knock him out of action long enough for you to destroy his master control device, effectively rendering him completely useless.

Edited by - Sandman on December 4, 2001 9:27:41 AM

Given enough time, I could probably destroy you with a rock. Wouldn''t be pretty, but it gets the job done.

Sadly for you Thrump, I think that timeToKill(Thrump, Multiphase Plasma Disassociator Cannon) < timeToKill(Mayrel, rock).

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Just Plain Wrong