Starting a team.

Why not check out the Help Wanted forum and join a team?

Can you or your story writer program? If not, one or both of you will probably need to learn before you can make the game; everyone has an idea for a game, but since programers are the only people who can make games without help, they are almost always the ones who get to decide what gets made in an amateur project. Even if you are planning to pay, you should still learn some programming, since otherwise you will have a very hard time understanding what the programmers on your team are up to. In any case, basically the skills you need to make a game are: programmer, level designer, 3d modeler and/or 2d computer artist (depending on whether you want a 2d or 3d game), sound effects maker/finder, music composer, web designer (if you want anyone else to know about your game), and someone who at least has more legal scruples than the average invertebrate. How many people it takes to get all those skills will just depend on how large/high quality your project is (which you probably will not be able to judge accurately unless you have some experience with making games), how much stuff you plan to steal from other people (sound effects and music are often ripped for amateur projects), and, of course, who is interested in working with you. If you don't want to be dependent on others, learn to program. Notice that I did not list game designer or story writer anywhere because, while a good game design is important and a good story is nice, most people can make a passable game design, but it is the execution of the design that determines whether the game is good or not (unless the game is very simple, like a board game), and that is mostly up to the programmer. Thus, I will say one more time: unless you are paying, you should really learn to program.

Good luck!

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Original post by mumpo...and that is mostly up to the programmer. Thus, I will say one more time: unless you are paying, you should really learn to program...

don't forget their is no I in team, the programmers don't own the game they don't say to the manager 'no we don't want to make your stupid pacman clone we dont care if it will sell better we want to make this' as well as the fact that more and more modelers are becoming important too since none will pay for a game which looks ugly. after all the programmers are very important yes they can make a game on their own but noadays they need a whole team, marketing, animators etc not just programmers. yes with out them nothing will get done but they have to all come to a compamise with what they can do and what people want.. not just want the programmers want.
also i will say counter strike... it started as a shareware/free mod then end up being an very popular game and money making. open source is one way to go with out cash yet you'll need to rember the people are doing it for fun not cash they have no obligation like in the real world so they can give up and move on if they get anoyed at each other so you need to make sure you like the people working with you, also you need to consider their learning too so you will hit bumps in the road with it.

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Original post by violetann don't forget their is no I in team, the programmers don't own the game they don't say to the manager 'no we don't want to make your stupid pacman clone we dont care if it will sell better we want to make this' as well as the fact that more and more modelers are becoming important too since none will pay for a game which looks ugly. ....

I think he was talking about amature game making not some AAA title

Ok guys, I think what Mumbo means is that, in order to make a game you need a programmer. programming is primary and graphics are secondary. that doesnt mean that graphics artists arent valued or needed, it just means that programming comes before story line writers etc...

i think you still need a basic idea even if theirs a few your playing with to give it some intreset yet may be not your frist game it's not required.

As a illustrator and storywriter you really really need to present your projekt in an good way to get programmres for an amature projekt.

As someone said the programmer is the backbone of a amature group. Becouse there wont be a game without them.

So you really have to entice and seduce the programmers with your idea and get them to work as a team with you. Else i think most programmers value their own time too much.

Just my 2 cents

Athos

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Original post by Strom Quote removed I think he was talking about amature game making not some AAA title

Bingo. I understand that to make a modern commercial game (or other large, very high-quality game), you need good people who can do all of the things I listed, and more. I also realize that for a commercial game, the people who are paying for everything are the people who call the shots, not the programmers. However, as Strom pointed out, I wasn't talking about how Valve makes games, since I was pretty sure that l-b-z isn't trying to make something on that scale. As for needing an idea for a game, I stand by my statement: ideas are not hard to come by, and the difference between a good game idea and a bad one is far more dependant on the details of how it is implemented than on how it looks on paper. And as for stories (which I consider to be completely separate from the game design/idea), a good story adds a lot to game, and I like it when a game has a good story. However, in almost all genres, a game that has good gameplay and lacks any story to speak of, or which has a bad story, will almost always be more fun to play than one that has an excellent story told well, but which has bad gameplay. The only genre I can think of where the story is actually essential, as opposed to just enhancing the game experience, is adventure games.

Thanx alot guys i really appreciate the feedback so much.Mumpo,i agree with you on the importance of programmers once the game is already being developed.i have noted this after your suggestion.i know programmrs are instrumental to the making of a game,and now i understand thier importance even more.
I do however have to disagree with you on the importance of concept and pre visual as well as writing as without these things there is no project.i may be wrong but i highly doubt that developers just start programming random things and then attach a story to it afterwards.I am not saying one is more important then the other,but i do think there is an order.Certain things you need to do in order to do other things.Hopefully you don,t take that as me trying to argue it with you because i am not,i think you obviously know what you are talking about,and i am quite sure you know more about this process then i do.

Athos,i think you and i are on the same wavelength because what i am working on tirelessly now is a presentation with character designs,enviormental work,fact sheets,animation studies(i am not an animator...yet lol) and just about everything else i can think of aestetically.The point of this thread was because i realize the amount of work i have to put into the conceptual art and realize i cannot program,model,write,draw and advertise all by myself.and actually,i actually was talking about trying to sell this to one of the major developers.Lofty goal probably but where there is a will there is a way.but back to the conversation,any more suggestions?

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Original post by l-b-z Athos,i think you and i are on the same wavelength because what i am working on tirelessly now is a presentation with character designs,enviormental work,fact sheets,animation studies(i am not an animator...yet lol) and just about everything else i can think of aestetically.The point of this thread was because i realize the amount of work i have to put into the conceptual art and realize i cannot program,model,write,draw and advertise all by myself.and actually,i actually was talking about trying to sell this to one of the major developers.Lofty goal probably but where there is a will there is a way.but back to the conversation,any more suggestions?

I haven't tried it myself, but from what I have heard, there is pretty much zero chance that you will be able to sell a first game to a major developer, even if it is well done. Realistically, you won't be able to produce a game that is both on the scale of and of the same quality as big bussiness games; you simply don't have the same monetary resources that they do. However, that is not to say that there aren't options if you want to sell the game. Shareware and/or a website connected to PayPal are options, of course. If you want to market it through a company with some sort of reputation (probably a good idea), you might have a look at Garage Games, which specializes in helping amateurs market their games. It also makes the Torque and Torque 2D game engines. I have never used it, but I have heard good things about Torque and not needing to make the game engine from scratch is definitely a plus, at least if you want to finish your game faster. Andre Lamothe's popular (though often scoffed at) game development books advertise Xtreme Games LLC for the same purpose, though minus the nice game engine. There are probably other such companies out there that I haven't heard of yet.

Putting together some sort of working demo will help attract people to your project. If you decide to learn to program, as I suggested, start now. It will take a while.