I'm looking for some information on good diceless RPG systems that incorporate missile (arrow/gun/thrown weapon) attacks. I'm thinking the hits will depend on a simple <,>, or = to calculation with critcal hit bonuses at a certain x>y value (eg x>y+5= critical hit). x and y modified by skill, actions (eg, is the target character running?) and equips. anyway, if there are any systems that function similar to this, or if the collective readers have any hints I might follow up, I would apprciate that input.

If you aren't going to use a rolling die method..

You need to come up with formulas.

They can range from simple to incredibly complex..

Just take your attributes like strength, and then your skills, and do some crazy mathematical operation with them, and use the answer :d...

Yeah, I get it, I was just wondering if anyone had experience with a good tabletop system or something similar.

A tabletop system that doesn't use dice? HERESY!

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Original post by abstractimmersion Yeah, I get it, I was just wondering if anyone had experience with a good tabletop system or something similar.

A few customisable card games used dice-less combat systems (the old Decipher Star Wars CCG springs to mind) that seemed to work well.

Chances are you're going to have to do a lot of playtesting to find a system which feels right.

Wouldn't it make it a tad bit too predictable?

I guess it depends on how your RPG works? But if you calculate how much dmg a gun does by substracting dmg from armour or something... does the player always do the same dmg on the monster? It kind of takes away from it...?

Am I totally missing something? :P

Usually the whole point of the die is to introduce uncertenty and randomness into the equation. Are you going to be compensating for this somehow?

Paperless RPGS... Most of them I know involve a referee, who either chooses weither something works or simply evaluates your role playing 'abilities' and awards a winner.

Wrestling eFederations worked like that. You'd have two or more people and a ref who would evaluate the match and then choose a winner based on how well a person Role Played.

All in all, not something a computer can do well.

Of diceless combat related strategy game, well, the only ones I can think of are chess and checkers, neither are very realistic and both only deal with melee combat. [smile]

Modern chess-like would be an interesting, but like chess, I'd make it as obvous as possible weither your strategy was going to work so many moves down the line. Weither the sniper can snipe you within X moves and weither moving two spaces will nullify their advantage.

It's quite doable - but I'm not sure you want to completely eliminate random.

Of course, life is both deterministic AND unpredictable, I'd suggest that you make sure that the only place you use random in your design is for flare: you don't roll to see whether or not you hit or get a critical strike, you roll to see the exact damage you do between a small range, to give the illusion that the calculations are a tad fuzzy. Or, you could use complex calculations that hide the actual goings-on from the user.

Essentially, you have a game where you control, aim, and do whatever it is you plan to do with your projectiles, but all modifiers are deterministic: your critical strike chance will be reduced as will the quality of your shot if you are moving, by a formulaic amount instead of a random roll - imagine having to aim for a character's head to get a critical strike. Reducing the chance would really be decreasing the margin of error for where the person aims - but still allow them to achieve critical hits if they have the neccesary skill. Compare this with simply running a hit/miss roll. It's the difference between random recoil in counterstrike and generic 1d20 RPG's.

Since you're working on an RPG, I'd suggest setting out a set of characteristics that you want to define your characters with. For example, strength could determine the damage you do, agility could determine how quickly you move and your crit penalty while moving, stamina could determine your hit points, and mana could determine your pool for special abilities. You can determine what the base stats are/expected stats are for a player and work out the formulas based on the norm, or you can use set ratios and determine how characters will get to spend their points.

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Wrestling eFederations worked like that. You'd have two or more people and a ref who would evaluate the match and then choose a winner based on how well a person Role Played.

I played something like that several years ago but with galdiators in an arena. It was a lot of fun. Been wondering lately what'd be the best way to capture that sort of thing in a computer game. I figured something that allowed you to choose from say 4 different actions (which very depending on skills availability & level) then when the choice is made a few seconds of action animation gets applied, then another choice is made available. No idea how well such a system would work out though and not planning on doing anything with it anytime soon.