How balanced are these races?

Water is a conductor, It would be weak to electricity. The only time that the water would be stronger, but still would be average attack against elec, would be if the water is 100% pureified because it would be free of minerals or if they body of water is thousands of times larger then the electricy. eg you would still be ok if a lightning bolt struck a lake that you were in.

I think it will be easy to defeat the Electroids because if you know you are fighting them, and this is a traditional (real-time) strategy game you can just only build "water warriors".

Also it seems that the average age is too high, I mean do you in any way prevent the player from killing creatures above the working age? Since it will be pretty annoying to have to keep creatures after they cant work.

Also wont it be difficult for a land-only race like humanoids or androids to fight water-only races like aquaoids?

EDIT:

Also the trophicoids seems weaker than the other species, I mean the only advantage is that they don't need food (just like electroids, which have other advantages too)

Wouldn't the Electroids require some kind of energy source to survive? Suppose they fed off the electricity generated in the clouds and when they do things like cast lightning bolds or generate magnetic fields to manipulate things it drains their "life energy" so they need to find a cloud or something to absorb energy from.

Technically, aren't they species rather than races?

To me, Trophicoids seem way too underpowered compared to the other species. They get the huge drawback of slow movement, production, and research, with their only strength being no need for food.

The Electroids have all that and more, plus they never die.

Can you explain the role of lifespan, working age range, growth rate, individual education in the game and how do they affect game balance?
Eternal youth, for instance, is very important for Electroid philosophy, society etc., but how does it help or hinder the Electroid player or influence his strategies?
Most stats you give are one or two steps removed from what usually matters: the totals, by planet or maybe city, of population, support costs, production and research output.

Before devising cool races, you should define rules in detail.
With a firm grasp of rules, you can imagine the gameplay differences caused by race features; then you can design the stats of races which would have interesting and different gameplay and match race concepts to your requirements.

I'm just going to leave this piece of advice: No amount of statistical balancing on paper will make up for prototyping this and play-testing it. By all means try to ensure your races (species?) are balanced, but be prepared to do some play-testing and change things; things often become apparent during gameplay that aren't obvious just by looking at the rules and stats.

I have to agree with Kazgoroth and LorenzoGatto. It's very hard to get a good idea of the game balance without actually playing the game, let alone without even knowing the rules.

The best thing to do would be to not worry too much about balance to begin with. Just make them so they look balanced to you, but make sure that they are easily edited. This way you can tweak them as imbalances show up during playtesting.

For a 4x you could probably quite easily prototype it with pen and paper, and thus be able to get some playtesting done without even writing any code. This could help you iron out issues with the rules as well as gross imbalances between the races.

Thank you all for the great criticism.

CTar: "I mean do you in any way prevent the player from killing creatures above the working age? Since it will be pretty annoying to have to keep creatures after they cant work." Thats a good point. I think I will change it so that after the minimum working age, they can work no mater how old they get. Suporting useless population would be anoying.

Kevinator: Ya, species is what they realy are. Thank you for pointing that out. I'll also find a way to balence Trophicoids and Electroids.

LorenzoGatti: Good idea. I'll work on the rules.

Kazgoroth: Ok, I'll do that. I'll work on balencing it once the game is more finished.

Oh man I'd be the aquaoids every day!

I played stars pretty heavily and they sound like the tri-immune 6% HE race ;) tri-immune = live anywhere, 6% growthrate = very low (could go up to 20%) and HE = double growthrate.

The better the planet the more of your growthrate you got and in this case you get 100% everywhere (tri-immune) so have a flat 12% growthrate up to 25% max capacity.

Faster tech + Faster Growth for aquaoids :OOOOOO

You'd take over the galaxy in seconds if played right.

I'm assuming lots here though and I guess the whole water/land thing is like the hab ranges in stars.

Androids look like AR... not a threat to start with but you'd be a fool to leave them.

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Original post by Encicra Water is a conductor, It would be weak to electricity. The only time that the water would be stronger, but still would be average attack against elec, would be if the water is 100% pureified because it would be free of minerals or if they body of water is thousands of times larger then the electricy. eg you would still be ok if a lightning bolt struck a lake that you were in.

If you throw a water baloon on an Electroid, the Electroid will take a serious damage, since the water will take some of it's electric charge.

Quote:

Original post by someboddy Quote: Original post by Encicra Water is a conductor, It would be weak to electricity. The only time that the water would be stronger, but still would be average attack against elec, would be if the water is 100% pureified because it would be free of minerals or if they body of water is thousands of times larger then the electricy. eg you would still be ok if a lightning bolt struck a lake that you were in. If you throw a water baloon on an Electroid, the Electroid will take a serious damage, since the water will take some of it's electric charge.

right, ... to Encicra ... the electricity doesn't damage the water, the water damages the electricity - by disipating it, much like a prism would destroy a light based creature. Obviously it is not that the water hurts the electricity itself, it is simply that it makes the creature unable to maintain its coherence / life. Much like getting fried in an electric chair doesn't destroy your body, it screws up your nerve impulse rhythm and stops your heart / brain activity.

What is a "4x"?

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Original post by Daniel Miller What is a "4x"?

It's a common term for empire building strategy games like Civ or MOO.

4X

There could be androids built for any condition, so some of the android units can survive and function in the desert or the ocean.

I'd just like to say that the idea for the aquaoids, dieing fast but being born faster, together with inheritable memory is extremely cool :)

But maybe the throphicoids and electroids need a bit more work. Anyway... I can see how you'd implement everything in a 4X, but what does each species' environment mean for the gameplay besides chosing which planets are easier to inhabit? Do you need different combat units for different environments, or it's all fought on space, or (the most idiotic thing ever :P ) the electroids simply cannot fight in water, the aquaoids can't fight in land, etc?

OK, I probley should have made this clear in the beginning. That way it wouldn't have been so confusing. Each planet has a certan % of land, water, and atmosphere. They are the space where the colonists live and where you can build buildings.
For example:
-Planet A:
--10% Land
--50% Water
--40% Atmosphere
This planet would be good for races that live in the water or atmosphere. If a race that lived on land colonized this planet there would not be much space available to use (Much lower max population and less space to build building). With the right technology, any race can build on any part of the planet. Although it would take more resources than building on part of the planet where they can normaly build.

Jotaf: As for the combat, I have not figured out exacty how it will work out yet. I havn't realy even though about the idea of combat on the planet.

Well, you should :)

About the planets' percentages, that division is nice but it might be a bit to artificial for sci-fi fans. There's a lot more to a planet that makes it habitable or not to a species: it can have a thick enough atmospherem, but its composition can be unbreathable for humans; a planet with all the right conditions but few water (desert planet) won't be easily habitable for them either; an all-water planet might be too cold for the aquoids or with too much radiation; a gas planet with lots of thunderstorms will make it impossible for energy beings to survive; etc. Basically that's a bit too abstract and the player won't feel too immersed.

There is an alternative though, without you having to go into too much detail here. A species stat is the percentage of worlds in the galaxy that are considered habitable for them. Then a planet might be ranked habitable for any species based on that; you could even say "X% habitable" if you want. It makes sense, at least to me :P , it's abstract but also not hard to digest, and you'll still get the same gameplay. And if you want you can also throw in some planet characteristics based on this, many people enjoy reading this kind of information in a game.

The electroid race sounds like a confused mix between raw electricity and a robot.

robot properties:
-they hover in the sky
-short out
-hurt by water


electricity properties:
-'pure' energy
-infinite age (robots should decay after a maybe a few centuries)
-don't need food or energy

The biggest problem is when you say they are made of 'pure energy.' Energy is not matter, so how can a race be made of energy? They have no physical existence and nowhere to float or anything.


Also, on the trophoids:

I see where you get the name, but 'troph' means eat, or something along those lines... What they should be called is 'phototrophoids,' meaning they only need to eat light.

But then comes another problem: Water defracts and greatly dampens light. How is a race that lives deep under water supposed to get enough light to support life? Plants barely need any energy as it is; a sentient, mobile being would need as much as a 100-acre forest's worth of absorbed light, yet it is the size of a person and lives in the dark waters. Even most seaweeds can't live very far beneath the surface (in terms of their highest leaf).

Hi,
If a creature made from electricity doesn't want to have contact with water, then livin on air isnt an option either. Iar has a degree of humidity per se, would be like a gaseous poison for it, higher umydity (tropics, jungle) can be highly corrosive. Only option would be to live in outer space. Isaac Asimov presented the idea in a story called 'She' where an entity formed of pure energy travelled through space and remembered how it was in old times when its race had a body.

To understando why water would damage an electrical entity just analyze the elecric resistance/impedance from elements. If a body made from pure energy could exist, probably it would have mastered some way to keep its energy coherent and concentrated in a standar environment (space, air, flogiston, you call it). When presented with a different environment like water or earth then that means the new resistance would be able to destabilize his structure. Touching a body of water would be like a human being touching a pond of hot lava. Trying to reach earth would be like throwing a human being to the sun.

Metals are good conductors, also some ceramics (as the ones used like high temperature superconductors) but not all the earth has metals. Water is also a good conductor when impurities are found. Even pure water would harm it. Humidity in air can make it uneasy... in fact thats how lightning strucks earth... charged particles in air trying to reach ground.

Now, you could think... if a planetary environment is so hostile to a energy being... why would he try to fight for it in first place? Just fly to space, maybe get energy from higher layers or the planet like electric charged storms, but never get down to earth.

On the other hand water creatures would have created some kind of limit for its body. Like a Jellyfish. Basically a creature 95% water but something separates it from the rest of the sea.

Now, being an intelligent jellyfish, you would never try to get into open land and you have no means to move there. Land would act like a big sponge, sun would be like a torch on skin for humans and wind like a sandstorm.

Now if those creatures are not like a jellyfish but pure water bodies, then they would get some kind of hydrokinesis. Being a water elemental it would be possible to move out of large bodies of water into land being able to gather the air moisture in order to 'breathe'. Sun would be your worst enemy and a desert would be like a hell. Other climate like north or south pole can affect these creatures making them slower or even paralyzing them.

On a battle between a electric and a water being the outcome would be decided by the environment. A water creature away from its sea/lake could be heated to death by an energy creature on space. The opposite would happen if the battle is near a mass of water.

Humans are the jack of all trades as usual. Can be drowned to death or fried merciless but can survive both attacks to certain degree. Against androids, humans would be just pounded to pieces.

Androids seems like a choice but its circuits can be fried down by water or electrical attacks makin this a weak race on the long run (only effective against humans).

On the other hand, Tropicoids are a plant lifeform. The only way for a plant to gain a intelligent status would be to dominate its environment thanks to a enhanced environment adaptative power. That means they can quickly (and I mean really fast) assimilate energy and water and transform it into nutrients. So water and eletrical attacks will only partially affect them making them highly resistant to both races. They can even resist coherent light (lasers) attacks from humans and fire. But in the same way, they can be harmed by physical attacks. A chainsaw, bullets, a big humanoid robot or krushing tank (yeah, with K) could harm them even when their body can resist it.

Tropicoids seems nearly undestructable and in fact they would be, but its downside would be its speed. Massive trunks moving slowly would be like Ents in lord of the ring... slowly breeding means no way to replace the fallen. Also no way to build flying machines but they can fight against them (like spores against air vehicles or similar).

That would be my ideas on this.
Luck!
Guimo